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Author Topic:   How long will the Golden Age window stay open?
James Friel
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posted February 24, 2003 01:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for James Friel   Click Here to Email James Friel        Reply w/Quote
So far, the reponses seem pretty encouraging. Most of the folks here in their '30s appear to believe that there will continue to be demand for early '40s material almost indefinitely. It's a skewed sample, of course--this is the DC Archives board, but encouraging nonetheless.

Do any of you who have expressed that belief have any specific younger fans in mind--teenagers or people in their 20s that you know personally who mightr be susceptible to developing a taste for Golden Age comics? I mean not just things like The Spirit and Plastic Man, but more representative material.

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TommyYesterday
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posted February 24, 2003 01:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for TommyYesterday   Click Here to Email TommyYesterday        Reply w/Quote
1)How old are you? What's your favorite period in comics, specifically DC? Do you enjoy reading comics from the '40s? How well do you relate to old movies? music? TV? What's the age of stuff that starts to be hard for you to relate to?

I'm 48. My favorite DC period -- one that I experienced firsthand -- was from 1960 (when I was a wee lad looking through my sister's Green Lantern, Justice League and Wonder Woman comics) through the late '60's (with a definite preference for the first 6 years or so of the decade). My favorite Marvels are also from the early to late '60's. The artists of that period really grab me -- they knew how to clearly tell a story with panel-pictures, most knew how to draw the human figure with recognizably human proportions, and their styles, both pencilers and inkers, were distinctive. Do I enjoy reading comics from the '40's? In the '60's I enjoyed reading reprints from the '40's -- old Siegel & Schuster "Superman" stories in an annual, or old Captain America & Sub-mariner reprints in "Fantasy Masterpieces" -- I was as happy as an archeologist discovering an ancient civilization when I read those '40's tales -- but I've grown disenchanted with '40's comics for the most part, at least very early '40's comics -- I'm one of those people who would be happier with Archives of the last 2 or 3 years of the Golden Age Flash & Green Lantern than with the first few years -- better art & story. Movies: I'm an old-movie junkie. For me, there's nothing that can compare to the gleaming black & white films of the mid-thirties to the late forties. I like lots of stuff after that, too, but the actors who hit it big in the mid-to-late 1930's are like gods and goddesses to me, and the craftsmanship that went into every aspect of a good movie back then, from the lighting to the sets to the costumes, make those movies time capsules of an era devoted to quality (and quantity! Those studio factories could really churn 'em out). Music: just doesn't play that big a part in my life. Although I love Broadway musicals and old movie musicals, I tend to think of music as background in an old movie, subordinate to the story. I only occasionally listen to either tapes or CDs -- some of my favorites to listen to are Rimsky-Korsakov's Scheherazade and Noel Coward's High Spirits and I like early '60's rock/pop -- you know, like "Johnny Angel" sung by Shelley Fabares. I just can't stand most of what's been popular for the past couple of decades and will run screaming from a room as a counterpoint to ugly screaming from a radio. TV: I've liked shows from every decade, but love "I Love Lucy," "The Adventures of Superman," "The Avengers," "The Forsyte Saga," "Upstairs/Downstairs," the old "Twilight Zone," and any incarnation of "Star Trek", good, bad or mediocre. The age of stuff I find hard to relate to? I relate to less and less in contemporary pop culture as I get older.


2)Do you think that the number of people interested in reading Golden Age material is going to shrink significantly soon?

Yes, as pointed out earlier, the work will just seem crude, and the characters will be so obscure that reading their adventures will be pointless.

2a)If so, will it drop below the threshold needed to sustain DC Archives from the 1940s?

Yes.

3)If you answered "yes" to (2a) above, do you think DC would be well advised to get the best 1940s material out there between hard covers as quickly as possible, or would they be wiser to attempt to retard the shrinkage of the market by a more controlled issuing of the material or by some other means?

Get the best out now while I can still walk to the comics shoppe.

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jape
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posted February 24, 2003 01:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jape   Click Here to Email jape        Reply w/Quote
1)42, favourite comics period Golden Age ever since I ready my first JLA/JSA team up at the tender age of seven; but love movies, comics and music from Jazz Age/Krazy Kat. Cahrlei Chaplin ownwards, right through to today.
2)I think as long as there are new comics using characters with roots in the Golden Age, there'll be some level of interest in te source material from a precentage of eaders. I think a bigger challenge is getting kids to read comics - where is the next generation of Archive buyers going to come from?
2a)If the level of sales of new comics continues to drops, definitely

3)I'm for stepping up the archive schedule; I'd buy at least two GA volumes a month but I also appreciate that presents problems for some others.

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Scippio
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posted February 24, 2003 01:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Scippio   Click Here to Email Scippio        Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by James Friel:
So here are my questions:
1)How old are you? What's your favorite period in comics, specifically DC? Do you enjoy reading comics from the '40s? How well do you relate to old movies? music? TV? What's the age of stuff that starts to be hard for you to relate to?

a) 29
b) The last 3 or 4 years
c) Yes
d) "Casablanca" and "Gone With the Wind" are some of my all time favorites. I also really like old Hitchcock like "39 Steps" and "The Lady Vanishes" from the 20's
e) I'm also a fan of Glen Miller and most WW2 era band leaders. I have also enjoyed music going back to the Civil War and the great classical masters like Motzart.
f) I only enjoy TV back to the 80's

quote:
2)Do you think that the number of people interested in reading Golden Age material is going to shrink significantly soon?

No more than the comics market in general.

quote:
2a)If so, will it drop below the threshold needed to sustain DC Archives from the 1940s?

If comics die so will the archives. As long as new books are coming out people will be interested in the history of the medium, if there are enough people buying comics to keep the monthly's afloat there will be enough to buy archives.

quote:
3)If you answered "yes" to (2a) above, do you think DC would be well advised to get the best 1940s material out there between hard covers as quickly as possible, or would they be wiser to attempt to retard the shrinkage of the market by a more controlled issuing of the material or by some other means?

I think that you should have your best material out there so that people can buy it. Once you get the good stuff out then work on the more obscure things.

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jape
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posted February 24, 2003 01:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jape   Click Here to Email jape        Reply w/Quote
That should be Charlie Chaplin, obviously, Mistakes due to being hassled by my eleven year old daughter wanting to use the PC. Go away and read a comic, child!

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Melkor
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posted February 24, 2003 02:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Melkor   Click Here to Email Melkor        Reply w/Quote
quote:
1)How old are you? What's your favorite period in comics, specifically DC? Do you enjoy reading comics from the '40s? How well do you relate to old movies? music? TV? What's the age of stuff that starts to be hard for you to relate to?

I'm 34. My favorite period in comics is probably silver age, but I've only ever been a mind DC fan. I love the silver age because they were the Marvel Age. Actually, I prefer DC's 1940's output to their silver age output, but regrettably, much of that 1940's stuff is frankly unreadable. However, Batman and others are a hoot, DC now owns the rights to some of the very best golden age stuff (Captain Marvel, Plastic man, Spirit, Blackhawk), and I like looking at golden age stuff because it's like a time machine. Everyone wears hats, women look glamorous, and there's a real sense of optimism and especially a sense of naive American invulnerability that I find charming. My favorite DC stuff is the Batman Adventures continuity Batman, (the best Batman comics ever published) but that's not very helpful for an archives discussion. as far as my favorite stuff that is suitable for archiving, that would be the golden age Captain Marvel.


quote:
2)Do you think that the number of people interested in reading Golden Age material is going to shrink significantly soon?

No. I think we're not going anywhere and not many younger people read this stuff anyway. I think the 1940's stuff always has the power to appeal, for a little while, to comic book "civilians" who are interested in it for historical reasons, or for the kitsch factor, but this is probably limited to the most recognizable golden age characters. As more and more well made Marvel superhero movies burn up the box office and with Superman, Batman, Captain Marvel, and Wonder Woman movies in development, I think golden age sales on these characters will actually increase.

quote:
2a)If so, will it drop below the threshold needed to sustain DC Archives from the 1940s?

Nope. Although I admit silver age tuff will always be more popular with DC continuity-heads.

quote:
3)If you answered "yes" to (2a) above, do you think DC would be well advised to get the best 1940s material out there between hard covers as quickly as possible, or would they be wiser to attempt to retard the shrinkage of the market by a more controlled issuing of the material or by some other means?

See previous answer. DC's doing fine with the archives. I just hope Marvel follows their lead with the Masterworks this year.

Mark

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profh0011
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posted February 24, 2003 04:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for profh0011   Click Here to Email profh0011        Reply w/Quote
1) Age: 43. Favorite period in comics: 1960's Marvels, some DCs, 1980's DCs, early 1940's DCs, some 1990s-up DCs & few Marvels, 1980's "independants". LOVE old movies. Faves include THE MARK OF ZORRO (Douglas Fiarbanks), PHANTOM OF THE OPERA (Lon Chaney, the ONLY one that counts), BRIDE OF FRANKENSTEIN, THE SAINT IN NEW YORK (Louis Hayward), the MR. MOTO series (Peter Lorre), AND THEN THERE WERE NONE (Agatha Christie film w/ Louis Hayward), various Biblical epics, esp. THE ROBE (Richard Burton & Victor Mature), THE DAY THE EARTH STOOD STILL (Michael Rennie), FORBIDDEN PLANET (Leslie Nielsen), DR. STRANGELOVE (Peter Sellers), FROM RUSSIA WITH LOVE (Sean Connery). Anything from the 70's-up feels too "modern" to me to feel right calling an "old movie"!
Favorite period for music is also the late 60's-- Monkees, Move, Beatles, Moody Blues, Deep Purple; but I have many favorites from the 70's, a few from the 80's, the 50's, some big band stuff from the 30's & 40's, film scores from all those periods-- and a TON of incredible "bar bands" from the 90's-up, most of who NOBDOY has ever heard of and who are as obsessed with the 60's as I am: The Friggs, Ben Vaughn, Los Straitjackets, The Space Cossacks, The Boss Martians, The Men From S.P.E.C.T.R.E., Stereophonic Space Sound Unlimited, Silver Surfer (Germany), The Chains, The Cybermen (Helsinki), Cadillac Hitmen, Destination: Earth!, Catfight!, Sit N' Spin, The Diaboliks, Kenn Kweder, Dash Rip Rock, Lonesome Bob... You just really gotta LOOK around, which too many are too lazy to do (which is why the "big labels" are able to keep shovelling S*** at the public-- but then, I hear THEY're operating at 90% LOSSES these days...)

2)Will Golden Age interest shrink? Depends not so much on age as mindset. I've long seen my interests expanding in both directions-- newer stuff as it comes out, and older stuff as I reach further and further back. Things that were "contemporary" back when become "period pieces" after long enough, an as I already have an interest in history that makes EVERYTHING before I was born qualify! Sometimes one just has to put ones-self in the proper mindset. Unlike those who have no interest in watching any B&W TV shows or movies-- don't even TRY silent films with them!! (heehee)

3) I just wanna see the "best" Golden Age material so I can READ it-- NOW!!! Never mind future generations. If they do the books now, they can always reprint them again if there's future interest.

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daytripper
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posted February 24, 2003 06:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for daytripper   Click Here to Email daytripper        Reply w/Quote
My favorite DC era is from the mid to late sixties, but that is mainly because that was when I started reading comics. The stuff from the golden age and the fifties is pretty good too, from what I've seen of it. I'm age 51, soon to be 52 (on April Fool's Day). I won't answer any of your other questions because it's too hard to keep up with them, but I suspect I'm one of those nuts who likes comics from all eras (well, maybe not the early ninetys, so much). AC Comics has, through their reprints, gotten me to like comics from the golden age and the fifties, most of which might be a little silly, and unsophisticated, but which I happen to like a lot. I'd like to see DC issue Golden Age era archives, simply because the audience will eventually move on or pass on (not me, I intend to live forever, just so I can get the next issue of whatever). But, if you consider the mix of comics being made today, with alternative/reprints/current comics, the fan of today really has a lot of good quality stuff to choose from.

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Allen Smith

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daytripper
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posted February 24, 2003 06:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for daytripper   Click Here to Email daytripper        Reply w/Quote
Just as a short follow up, I don't like the earliest golden age material because of its crudity, but I'd say the quality of the stories and the art got better fairly fast from '41 on. There was a blissfully short time where I didn't want to look at Kirby's earliest work, because it didn't seem to match up in quality with his later work, but through efforts like Greg Theakston's The Complete Jack Kirby, I was able to see the virtues of Jack's early work, and like it a great deal. It's much the same with work by other artists, like Kubert, Meskin, Infantino, et al.

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Allen Smith

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Amentep
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posted February 24, 2003 07:46 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Amentep        Reply w/Quote

1) I am 31. I don't have a favorite period in comics, I've found plenty worthwhile in all era's of comics. I do enjoy reading some comics from the 40s - and I dislike reading other comics from the 40s; a lot of it depends on the comic . I like old and new movies both. Same with music and TV. Most anything that has some quality in it I can relate to on some level; I do have a bit of trouble with turn of the century to about the 20s popular music, but I think this is more due to lack of exposure than to the quality of the music being different from that time.

2)I don't know; my gut instinct says it isn't. A lot of people I know when I started reading comics and talking with other fans I tended to hear about "legendary runs", and whether its Jack Cole on Plastic Man, Stan Lee and Jack Kirby on Fantastic Four, or Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons on Watchmen eventually that word of mouth gets around and I and people I know were interested in seeing what all the praise was about. It may be at somepoint this word of mouth for the older stories will die out, but I think as long as people are open to talking about older comics, there will always be an awaiting fan base for reprints of those stories. If that makes any sense.

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FOG
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posted February 24, 2003 07:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for FOG        Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by KryptoSuperDog:
2a)If so, will it drop below the threshold needed to sustain DC Archives from the 1940s?

Print the best stuff and they will buy it. Print another GA Flash and they will not.


Krypto,

Hey bud. What's up with your constant bashing of GA Flash Archives? Are you on a personal crusade to see that it never gets a second volume? Geesh!

My past posting history shows that I never get on anyone or try to start flame wars, so don't take this the wrong way. BUT, it sure seems to me like you go out of your way to bash this series at every opportunity.

Gary "it's one thing to pimp what you like, but something else entirely to continually bash a particular archive, IMHO" O.

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NickDanger
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posted February 24, 2003 08:14 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for NickDanger   Click Here to Email NickDanger        Reply w/Quote
1) How old are you? What's your favorite period in comics, specifically DC? Do you enjoy reading comics from the '40s? How well do you relate to old movies? music? TV? What's the age of stuff that starts to be hard for you to relate to?

I’m 39 and my favorite period of DC stuff would have to be the early ‘70s—in particular the years that Infantino was publisher. This was also the time that I first discovered DC comics, so it’s probably a sentimental choice. But wasn’t Nick Cardy the best damn cover artist ever? Sigh…

The older I get, the more I appreciate older movies, television shows, music and comic books. When I was a kid, I hated the reprint stories in the “100-Page Super Spectaculars”. When I re-read them, I find that they’re my favorite parts of the books.

I still enjoy the new stuff from all media, but my tastes have become more “refined”. I’ve gone from Jefferson Starship to the Jackie Gleason Orchestra and from Pat Benatar to Norah Jones. It drives my girlfriend crazy.

I begin to have trouble relating to material prior to the 20th Century, but even then I can appreciate it if it’s of quality.

2) Do you think that the number of people interested in reading Golden Age material is going to shrink significantly soon?

It will if more people don’t begin reading comics—new or vintage. The fewer people reading comics in general, the fewer that there will be reading the golden age stuff.

2a) If so, will it drop below the threshold needed to sustain DC Archives from the 1940s?

I don’t see the ‘40s material being a separate issue. If there’s not an increase in readership, all of the archives are going to go away, not just the golden age stuff.
.
3)If you answered "yes" to (2a) above, do you think DC would be well advised to get the best 1940s material out there between hard covers as quickly as possible, or would they be wiser to attempt to retard the shrinkage of the market by a more controlled issuing of the material or by some other means?

I didn’t answer yes, but I’ll comment anyway. One of the reasons that Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman survived the end of the golden age was not only because they were great characters, but because they had the best stories! *Some* of the golden material that I’ve read is simply dreadful! These three characters consistently had wonderful stories! Therefore, I would be for judiciously releasing material of quality, so that readers get the cream of the crop. Throwing garbage into an archive format is not going to make it good regardless of the era it comes from.

------------------
"I thought 'Kid Rock' was a member of the Legion of Super-Heroes..."

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Joe Pacheco
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posted February 24, 2003 09:33 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Joe Pacheco   Click Here to Email Joe Pacheco        Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by James Friel:
So far, the reponses seem pretty encouraging. Most of the folks here in their '30s appear to believe that there will continue to be demand for early '40s material almost indefinitely. It's a skewed sample, of course--this is the DC Archives board, but encouraging nonetheless.

Do any of you who have expressed that belief have any specific younger fans in mind--teenagers or people in their 20s that you know personally who mightr be susceptible to developing a taste for Golden Age comics? I mean not just things like The Spirit and Plastic Man, but more representative material.


Just a funny note to make everyone feel old, my younger brother (22) gave me his copy Crisis TPB that he bought for himself but couldn't finish because of the "old-fashioned" Perez art. I gave him a copy of Watchmen, but once again, the art wasn't dynamic enough. His favorite comics are 100 Bullets, Jim Lee's Batman and Ultimate X-Men.

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Patrick Gerard
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posted February 24, 2003 09:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Patrick Gerard   Click Here to Email Patrick Gerard        Reply w/Quote
22, here. I'd be willing to expand my horizons out to some different Golden Age material but primarily stuff that has some kind of "hook" for me as a reader.

As in little known creations of big name Golden Age creators... Or appearances of Superman and Batman outside the titles in which they appeared monthly...

Although I'd certainly be CURIOUS, I doubt I could ever see myself spending $50 on a JERRY LEWIS ARCHIVE or a L'IL ABNER ARCHIVE or a PHANTOM LADY archive.

On the flipside, I'd be all for plunking down $3.50 for a monthly classics reprint book if the coloring and the linework were cleaned up and there was some kind of editorial page with historical comments about the work. I'd also just assume not get comics as they were originally printed but 'best of...' collections, preferably low key issues that wouldn't normally get reprinted in an 80 Page Giant or a Millenium Edition. Maybe some fresh cover art and a *theme* for each issue... (Like baseball stories or stories about Atlantis or stories that ended up as sequels to eachother.)

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batfan63
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posted February 24, 2003 09:51 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for batfan63   Click Here to Email batfan63        Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by James Friel:
So here are my questions:
1)How old are you? What's your favorite period in comics, specifically DC? Do you enjoy reading comics from the '40s? How well do you relate to old movies? music? TV? What's the age of stuff that starts to be hard for you to relate to?

2)Do you think that the number of people interested in reading Golden Age material is going to shrink significantly soon?

2a)If so, will it drop below the threshold needed to sustain DC Archives from the 1940s?

3)If you answered "yes" to (2a) above, do you think DC would be well advised to get the best 1940s material out there between hard covers as quickly as possible, or would they be wiser to attempt to retard the shrinkage of the market by a more controlled issuing of the material or by some other means?



1.) I am 39. My favorite period is the mid 1970s when I was old enough to understand comics. I loved the DC 100 pagers, which sparked an interest in Golden Age characters. I like all forms of pop culture, less interested in the 1940s music--although I like some swing, and love films--especially the horror films and film noir.

2.) Nope.

3.) I hope DC continue to archive the old comics. It is still fresh for the young readers and adds historical and cultural value to the time period they reflect.

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Not My Real Name
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posted February 25, 2003 12:54 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Not My Real Name   Click Here to Email Not My Real Name        Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by James Friel:
So far, the reponses seem pretty encouraging. Most of the folks here in their '30s appear to believe that there will continue to be demand for early '40s material almost indefinitely. It's a skewed sample, of course--this is the DC Archives board, but encouraging nonetheless.

Do any of you who have expressed that belief have any specific younger fans in mind--teenagers or people in their 20s that you know personally who mightr be susceptible to developing a taste for Golden Age comics? I mean not just things like The Spirit and Plastic Man, but more representative material.


I have two children, ages 5 and 8, who are gaining an appreciation of movies and music from times past. They listen to jazz, blues, reggae, Dylan, Beatles, New Wave, 70s funk, grunge, as well as the new stuff. They've seen silent films, black and white, and subtitled (a little harder when you have to whisper dialogue into a young ear). Some movies that went over especially well: Singin' in the Rain, The Seven Samurai, Earth Vs. The Flying Saucers, The General, La Belle et la Bete, and 2001: A Space Odyssey.

My eight-year-old has begun using his allowance to purchase his own comics, preferring Justice League Adventures and Simpsons Comics. He knows the Archives (and other hardbacks) are there for him, too, as long as he treats them with extra special care. He has read most of Batman Archives vol. 1 and the Greatest Batman & Superman Stories Ever Told.

I have no doubt, as I add more Golden Age stories to the collection, that he will enjoy these, too.

------------------
-Mario

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KryptoSuperDog
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posted February 25, 2003 01:07 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for KryptoSuperDog        Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by FOG:
Krypto,

Hey bud. What's up with your constant bashing of GA Flash Archives? Are you on a personal crusade to see that it never gets a second volume? Geesh!

My past posting history shows that I never get on anyone or try to start flame wars, so don't take this the wrong way. BUT, it sure seems to me like you go out of your way to bash this series at every opportunity.

Gary "it's one thing to pimp what you like, but something else entirely to continually bash a particular archive, IMHO" O.


I don't actually have anything against that volume in particular...it's just that I constantly use it as a good example of When Archives Go Bad. Lots of people on these boards constantly make fun of NTT Archives in similar ways.

My general feeling is that a lot of GA material is even weaker than GA Flash was, and that a lot of people are using up a lot of energy trying to get them into print, simply because their favorite JSA members appeared in comics that are rare and very expensive, and they want to read them.

I propose that DC do a special JSA tpb that reprints at least one story of each member from the 40s, (and preferably stuff that hasn't appeared in archives or Millenium editions). That way, the fans and editors can get a feel for what the material is really like, and whether any of it deserves the Archive treatment. Think of it as a sampler. How many of you would buy a $20-$25 tpb that had stories including:

Wildcat
Mr. Terrific
Johnny Thunder
Spectre
Hourman
Starman
Hawkman
Flash
Green Lantern
Wonder Woman
Batman
Superman
Atom
Dr. MidNite
and maybe one JSA team-up for good measure.

I think it'd sell very well, and if nothing else, it would satisfy many people's curiosity over what that material is like, and whether or not they really want to see all those series archived.

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Joe Pacheco
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posted February 25, 2003 02:34 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Joe Pacheco   Click Here to Email Joe Pacheco        Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by KryptoSuperDog:
I don't actually have anything against that volume in particular...it's just that I constantly use it as a good example of When Archives Go Bad. Lots of people on these boards constantly make fun of NTT Archives in similar ways.

My general feeling is that a lot of GA material is even weaker than GA Flash was, and that a lot of people are using up a lot of energy trying to get them into print, simply because their favorite JSA members appeared in comics that are rare and very expensive, and they want to read them.

I propose that DC do a special JSA tpb that reprints at least one story of each member from the 40s, (and preferably stuff that hasn't appeared in archives or Millenium editions). That way, the fans and editors can get a feel for what the material is really like, and whether any of it deserves the Archive treatment. Think of it as a sampler. How many of you would buy a $20-$25 tpb that had stories including:

Wildcat
Mr. Terrific
Johnny Thunder
Spectre
Hourman
Starman
Hawkman
Flash
Green Lantern
Wonder Woman
Batman
Superman
Atom
Dr. MidNite
and maybe one JSA team-up for good measure.

I think it'd sell very well, and if nothing else, it would satisfy many people's curiosity over what that material is like, and whether or not they really want to see all those series archived.


DC could put out a softcover version of The Greatest Golden Age Stories Ever Told. I doubt that it would sell, as the top-selling trades are books like 100 Bullets. Maybe a Hardcover Version with a psuedo-Archives dress for the Archive/GA crowd. Something that looks like an Archive, but isn't.

In any case, after reading the book years ago, the only stories that I fondly remember were the GA Hawkman and Robotman stories. Of couse now I realize that Hawkman was a bunch of Foster/Raymond swipes (which probably isn't a bad thing if you think about it).

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Lightning + Chemicals
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posted February 25, 2003 02:47 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Lightning + Chemicals        Reply w/Quote
1)How old are you? What's your favorite period in comics, specifically DC? Do you enjoy reading comics from the '40s? How well do you relate to old movies? music? TV? What's the age of stuff that starts to be hard for you to relate to?
____________________________________________

42. I like all of the comics periods. The period from 68-75 is my touchstone -- however what really intrigued me was reading about Miller's Batman in Rolling Stone, buying that and then absorbing all of the 80's breakthrough comics work in rapid succession (Moore, Chaykin, Baron/Rude, Hernandez Bros., etc.). I enjoyed the so-called "Dark Age" of comics greatly -- then, of course, it ran out of steam when all the "mature" twists were exhausted. Now I mostly enjoy the classics, like the Archives, Marvel Essentials and Carl Barks. I think art is all forms is timeless as I actively listen to Louie Armstrong, Bach and enjoy Michaelangelo and Shakespeare, so Golden Age comics don't bother me at all. I guess I draw the timeline at Chaucer -- too olde! Cain't stande hyme.
____________________________________________
2)Do you think that the number of people interested in reading Golden Age material is going to shrink significantly soon?
____________________________________________
No. People who are drawn to explore the Golden Age are probably most interested in the early development of the comic book art form and possibly the development of the archetypical superheroes, although I'm sure there are also some 60-year-old men looking for nostalgia.
____________________________________________
2a)If so, will it drop below the threshold needed to sustain DC Archives from the 1940s?
____________________________________________
3)If you answered "yes" to (2a) above, do you think DC would be well advised to get the best 1940s material out there between hard covers as quickly as possible, or would they be wiser to attempt to retard the shrinkage of the market by a more controlled issuing of the material or by some other means?
____________________________________________
Again, I think that anyone who buys more than one Archive is not a casual nostalgia-seeking fan, but someone seriously interested in the history of the comic book art form -- therefore I think the consumer's age is not as relevant as you may think....

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Kamandi Last Boy on Earth
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posted February 25, 2003 02:52 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kamandi Last Boy on Earth        Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by KryptoSuperDog:
I don't actually have anything against that volume in particular...it's just that I constantly use it as a good example of When Archives Go Bad. Lots of people on these boards constantly make fun of NTT Archives in similar ways.

That what you get with a series that reprints EVERYTHING instead of cherry-picking the best. You'll get a deluxe high quality hardcover with some cr@ppy stories. There's not much point is dissing a reprint because the stories were poor in the original....

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BearPaws
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posted February 25, 2003 03:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for BearPaws        Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by James Friel:
1)How old are you? What's your favorite period in comics, specifically DC? Do you enjoy reading comics from the '40s? How well do you relate to old movies? music? TV? What's the age of stuff that starts to be hard for you to relate to?

1a\ 35, born in 1968.
1b\ I like the mid-Silver Age best, when things were fresh yet matured, but not yet relevant.
1c\ I enjoy some of the 1940's material, particularly Plastic Man, Wonder Woman, and Black Canary. Superman is interesting, at best, merely for its historical significance and subsequent evolution. All-Star is growing on me. Most of the others have trouble keeping my attention for the entire volume.
1d\ I can't say I "relate to" old movies or music at all, probably because I experience them out of context. Oddly enough, I've greatly enjoyed "Black & White Overnight" on Game Show Network for several years -- last night, I watched "What's My Line?" from Xmas 1955, "I've Got a Secret" from 1956, and "To Tell The Truth" from late 1961. For me, nothing has ever captured the real emotions of things like McCarthyism, Sputnik, the Cold War, and the Nixon/Kennedy debate in quite the way that a live, unscripted game show can. The shows are aired more-or-less in order (they can't show all of them because they were destroyed or have in-show cigarette commercials!) so it's easy to bond with the celebrity panelists and know what was going on at the time the program was aired. (On the other hand, it's a little disconcerting to know that Fred Allen has only 3 months to live.)
1d\ Honestly, I have trouble with material after 1975 or so, except for the late 80s when my collecting was at its peak. I can't really explain it. There are a couple of recent books that I like (H-E-R-O is surprisingly good and I loved Preacher) but the rest just doesn't appeal to me.

quote:
2)Do you think that the number of people interested in reading Golden Age material is going to shrink significantly soon? If so, will it drop below the threshold needed to sustain DC Archives from the 1940s?

I rather doubt that the number of people interested in Golden Age material will drop any time soon. There are a lot of treasures yet to be discovered by many of us (who else here was surprised by the quality of Black Canary?), so if the market can continue to support production, there will always be something new being put out to attract "new" readers. For a while, anyway.

quote:
3)If you answered "yes" to (2a) above, do you think DC would be well advised to get the best 1940s material out there between hard covers as quickly as possible, or would they be wiser to attempt to retard the shrinkage of the market by a more controlled issuing of the material or by some other means?

Saturating the market too soon can only hurt them in the long run. The limiting case would be for everything ever published to be available now. If I knew that were the case, would I be in a rush to buy it? Probably not. It would also mean that they could potentially go out of print at the same time, and that's no fun.

Part of the appeal to these volumes is the advance knowledge and discussion that surrounds each one (at least, here on the boards). By the time the volume is actually published, I feel like I already know everything about it except what it actually looks like. Anticipating the 2nd volume only makes it that much more enjoyable when it finally arrives.

That's my 2¢.

------------------
"I knew I wasn't risking my secret identity with you! After all,
     if I can't trust the President of the United States, who can I trust?"
• Superman to JFK, Action Comics #309, February 1964

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James Friel
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posted February 25, 2003 03:28 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for James Friel   Click Here to Email James Friel        Reply w/Quote
God.
It had never occurred to me that the ban on cigarette advertising would apply to commercials as cultural artifacts. You can't possibly understand American culture of the 1950s if you've never seen a giant Old Gold pack dancing on long, shapely legs. No, they weren't animated, rither.

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Lee Semmens
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posted February 25, 2003 06:25 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Lee Semmens        Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by James Friel:
1)How old are you? What's your favorite period in comics, specifically DC? Do you enjoy reading comics from the '40s? How well do you relate to old movies? music? TV? What's the age of stuff that starts to be hard for you to relate to?

2)Do you think that the number of people interested in reading Golden Age material is going to shrink significantly soon?

2a)If so, will it drop below the threshold needed to sustain DC Archives from the 1940s?

3)If you answered "yes" to (2a) above, do you think DC would be well advised to get the best 1940s material out there between hard covers as quickly as possible, or would they be wiser to attempt to retard the shrinkage of the market by a more controlled issuing of the material or by some other means?


1) 42.

My favorite period in comics is 1958-75.

I enjoy reading 1940s comics, although some of the more ineptly drawn features can be pretty hard going. Some badly written stories from this (or any) period are partly redeemed if drawn by a top artist (ie. Burnley, Infantino, Toth, Sprang, etc). My favorites from this period are probably Batman, Blackhawk (particularly if by Crandall), Plastic Man, Starman (Burnley art) throughout, Superman from about 1941 onwards, Marvel Family characters from about 1945 on, Green Lantern, All-Star and Flash from about 1947 on (the latter in particular is vastly superior to the earlier stuff), and I have a bit of fondness for Dr Fate, Hourman and Spectre.

I prefer movies made before about 1965, and loathe most movies made since the 1980s. I feel most movies made these days tend to revolve too much around a big name "star" or special effects, rather than a good plot or characterization. I would rather watch a good movie with "lesser" actors, than a fair one (or worse) with a so-called big name.

As a rule I prefer older music: the Beatles; Simon & Garfunkel; Don McLean and Bread.

My tastes in TV shows are quite diverse. Generally TV shows made before about 1960 don't appeal to me at all, although The Adventures of Superman is an exception. My favorites are probably The Simpsons, any of the Star Trek series, apart from the original one, Columbo (my alltime favorite police/detective show), the Samurai (a 1960s Japanese series), some of the Warner Brothers cartoons (but not Road Runner, Speedy Gonzalez, Foghorn Leghorn, or Pepe Le Pew).

The "age of stuff" doesn't worry me - it's the quality that counts.


2) I think we are still some years away from the appeal of Golden Age material greatly diminishing. There should always be a market for artists like Lou Fine (if we ever see any more of his work - hardly any of it has seen the light of day since the early 1970s), Reed Crandall, and Carmine Infantino, for instance.


3) I am of the opinion that DC should publish the best of their Golden Age material as soon as possible, particularly post-1946 Flash and Green Lantern, and yet, at the same time judiciously mix it up with the dross, or lesser stuff. One of the problems of adhering to a program of strictly chronological publication of archives is that, with Flash in particular, and to somewhat lesser extent Green Lantern, we have several volumes of extremely crude art (Hal Sharp and Martin Naydel aghh!) to get through before we get to the top quality period.

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DaBubba
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posted February 25, 2003 01:01 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for DaBubba   Click Here to Email DaBubba        Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by James Friel:

So here are my questions:
1)How old are you? What's your favorite period in comics, specifically DC? Do you enjoy reading comics from the '40s? How well do you relate to old movies? music? TV? What's the age of stuff that starts to be hard for you to relate to?


I'm 36. My favorite DC era is golden age, though it depends on which title or character we're talking about. I prefer 40's Superman and Wonder Woman, but 50's Batman and 70's JLA.

I can "relate" to good material from any era. I was born in 1967, but I love golden age comics. When I was a kid, my favorites were the 80 or 100-page giants and reprint series that had golden age stories. I got the Superman/Batman 30's-70's hardcovers for Christmas and wore them out. (Still have 'em, still read 'em. They are this close to falling apart, but I will never part with them!) I grew up thinking the older a story, the cooler it was. Still think that way, to a degree.

Maybe it's because my parents grew up during the Depression and WWII. I heard lots of stories about the era and golden age comics were one way to relate to my folks. (Imagine my surprise when my dad recognized Jay Garrick! I thought that was the coolest thing! )

Movies, music, tv : When I think of "favorites" in any form, I drift towards the era that produced the most creative excitement. For me, for super-hero comics, that's the golden age. A bunch of ordinary joes who loved comics and super-heroes created a vast amount of material that sparkles with their own energy and enthusiasm. I like jazz from the 40's-50's, because (for me), it crackles with that same energy, as does rap/hip-hop from the late 80's, early 90's (before mindless gangsta rap took over; I'll take Public Enemy and De La Soul over Eminem any day...)

quote:
Originally posted by James Friel:

2)Do you think that the number of people interested in reading Golden Age material is going to shrink significantly soon?

2a)If so, will it drop below the threshold needed to sustain DC Archives from the 1940s?


Everything is cyclical, but I don't interest in golden age comics will shrink that drastically. People are still buying Elvis and Beatles records and Dashiell Hammett novels. Though the consumer base is smaller, comics nostalgia is no different than any other.

It's possible that we see less interest for Golden Age material for two reasons : 1) fandom is shrinking 2) There's more material. In 1960, comics had been around 25 years, give or take. At this point, comics are almost 70 years old. There are simply more eras for fans to obsess over.

The main thing is that people need to be exposed to the material. Are $50 archives the best way to do that? Maybe, maybe not, but if I were a DC muckety-muck and I wanted to sell lots of golden age material, I'd be looking at additional, less expensive venues for the material.

The industry needs to expand the market for all comics, period. If they can do that, the different eras will take care of themselves.

quote:
Originally posted by James Friel:

3)If you answered "yes" to (2a) above, do you think DC would be well advised to get the best 1940s material out there between hard covers as quickly as possible, or would they be wiser to attempt to retard the shrinkage of the market by a more controlled issuing of the material or by some other means?


I think DC would be wise to space out the material as best they can. A new #1 can create enough excitement in the fan base to sustain the line for a few months. Buzz for a Spectre # 1 can spill over onto a GA Flash #2 (hint, hint) On the other hand, if DC shoots their wad of heavy-hitters, they might not be able to generate as much enthusiasm for a long string of volumes 2, 3, 4, etc.

In 2003, we're getting four new volume 1's in six months. For the long haul, I think DC would do better to spread them out over a longer period of time. (As possible. I don't think DC necessarily planned for this many new series to come out this quickly, but they had a new Aquaman series and DCD toys to market with the archives, and this is just how the schedule worked out.)

Good thread.

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TheRogueLegionnaire
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posted February 25, 2003 01:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for TheRogueLegionnaire        Reply w/Quote
1)How old are you? 27

What's your favorite period in comics, specifically DC? Late 50's/Early 60's

Do you enjoy reading comics from the '40s? Yes

How well do you relate to old movies? music? TV? What's the age of stuff that starts to be hard for you to relate to? I like all 3. I enjoy movies from the silent era on, music from 1962 to 1997 ( a few exceptions in subsequent years. TV - Honeymooners and Lucy up thru today. The classics never die.

2)Do you think that the number of people interested in reading Golden Age material is going to shrink significantly soon? No, but I think eventually new comics will disappear.

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